Looking to upgrade the low-quality recessed lighting in my home, all of which are 4" recessed cans. I want lights with high CRI, low flicker, high lumens, and tunable options (or dim-to-warm). However, most consumer options seem to have some limitation:
Yuji SunWave is great but not tunable, and A19/BR30 doesn’t fit 4" recessed cans.
Koto HC fits 4" cans and is dim-to-warm but has flicker depth around 15-35%.
I’m hoping to find a local residential lighting designer who could customize an LED chip with a quality driver, make it tunable, etc. All the components are available; they just need assembly into a final product for consumers.
Any tips on how I could find someone who does this in the SF Bay Area? Most lighting companies I find seem to recommend products rather than custom solutions.
In general, what you’re asking for won’t be UL listed, so if there’s ever a fire, insurance might not cover it. Custom designs aren’t something most manufacturers do unless you’re placing a very large order or paying a lot.
@Basil
What if I order 30-60 bulbs? Is that a big enough order? And by ‘a lot,’ how much are we talking? If this isn’t feasible, should I consider replacing the 4" cans with 6" ones, possibly using Yuji BR30s for more lumens?
@Charlie
UL certification alone might run about $10,000 just for the certification letter. I work in power systems, not lighting, so it’s a rough estimate but should be close.
Phoenix said: @Charlie
UL certification alone might run about $10,000 just for the certification letter. I work in power systems, not lighting, so it’s a rough estimate but should be close.
Yep, that’s about what I was told by a lighting manufacturer I work with a few years back.
@Charlie
A small order like 30-60 bulbs probably wouldn’t justify the cost. You’re likely looking at engineering fees and at least $200 per bulb, plus UL certification costs around $10,000.
That’s really more of a custom LED project than lighting design. A lighting designer typically works on the end effect and ambiance by selecting available fixtures that meet specific needs, rather than building lights from scratch. If you want custom lights built to order, that’s usually only available with minimum orders, often in the thousands, plus setup and engineering fees. China might be a place to look if you’re willing to go that route.
Charlie said: @Olin
Thanks for clarifying! Do you know of any off-the-shelf products that might already meet my needs?
Try USAI, Alphabet, Lumenwerx, Focal Point, Aculux, Precise, Lucifer, Ketra, or Zaniboni. They offer high-quality options, though specific features vary.
Joss said:
For that budget, consider upgrading to Ketra or Rania fixtures along with a Homeworks control system.
Do you know where I can find SPD, TM-30, and flicker reports for Ketra? How does it compare to Yuji and Koto HC in terms of specs? Also, any idea on the cost?
@Charlie
Ketra is known for quality and runs around $1,000 per fixture installed. Rania is a bit cheaper but only offers white light. Ketra is full color. You’d probably need to contact their support for specific data sheets since they’re sold through dealers.
Edit: I have a Koto HC in my kitchen and love it, though Ketra would be a clear upgrade. It’s in a different league in terms of quality.
Charlie said: @Joss
Is there any add-on I could install with the Koto HC (like a capacitor or extra driver) to bring flicker depth closer to Yuji’s level (<5%)?
I’m not aware of any way to do that. Plus, adding a non-standard component would likely void your warranty and potentially affect insurance coverage if something went wrong.
@Charlie
The flicker-free performance was part of Ketra’s design goals, and they achieved it. I have it in my home, and it’s as good as advertised. You should visit the Lutron Experience Center in LA if you want to see it firsthand.