As /u/IntelligentSinger783 pointed out, anything lower than 2000K is getting into orange territory, not white. And for the budget you’re looking for, it’s not going to offer much in the way of an integrated fixture.
Some options:
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Standard E27 can with a smart bulb like Hue, Govee, Wiz, etc that offer the ability to set a color, then reduce saturation (which just adds white into the mix).
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Standard E27 socket with “vintage” filament bulb in it, since those often can be found at 1800K or 2200K.
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Standard E27 socket and 2700K lamp, with a piece of warming gel over the lens.
>which is a great product, but $200/location!
I want to impress that $200 per fixture is relatively inexpensive as far as lighting fixtures go.
@Fisher
love the creative alternatives!
- Smart bulbs: i’ve found it to be quite difficult to get good color in the very warm white range of the bulbs i’ve tried. the 1800K-2100K realm always appears/feels artificial and off to me compared to an actual dimmed incandescent. i guess i’m dubious of the CRI in this region? any tips? i should try to measure this to see if i’m onto something or making it up
- Vintage bulbs: these are the lightbulbs i like the most at night, and our space just doesn’t work well for lots of distributed lamps. overhead vintage is a creative idea. would have to find the right bulbs.
- Warming gel: any tips on where i could find the right gels? i’ve thought of this solution before and was hoping to find a “warm white gel collection” or something but haven’t succeeded
also, i guess to put E26/E27 bulbs in the ceiling, i’d have to find a way to adapt my 4" and 6" shallow recessed new construction LED downlight housings (Halo H245ICAT) into E26/E27 downlight bulb housings. i imagine this would be expensive and maybe not super aesthetic.
@Oli
> i’d have to find a way to adapt my 4" and 6" shallow recessed new construction LED downlight housings
You don’t, they’re not rated for that. And it would have been a good thing to mention in your original post that you already have LED specific cans installed.
>any tips on where i could find the right gels?
You can find good ones under the brand names of Lee, Rosco, GAM, Apollo, etc. You’d be looking for a “Half CTO” (color temp orange), which would take a 3000K down to 2000K or a 2700K down to 1800Kish.
@Fisher
mmmm dang, i knew i was missing an important spec. thanks. will edit my original post and add that. understood no easy way to adapt my cans for bulbs.
and thanks for the pointer on the gels! love it. will look into it.
There are lots of warm dimming products that will get down to 2000k-1800k but there are no static 2000k-1800k recessed modules outside of a few niche commercial products. That kelvin temperature is going to basically feel monochromatic like a sodium bulbs, so it has very limited desirability for mass market. As for warm dimming or tuneables. It’s a very normal function.
Elco has 2 warm dimming koto variants. 3000-1800k (sunset dim) and a 4000k-2000k (human centric, high contrast elk11HC). Those will be about 80-100 depending on how they are speced. They also have a 2400k static dimmable koto. They also have a sunset dim retrofit in 4” and 5/6”( for example EL410SDW)
Less expensive warm dimming options would be lotus (50ish)(3500-2500 or 3000-1800k) or halo RL (20-30$ on Amazon) which has 5 CCT static options, a warm dimming switch from 3000k-1800k and 2 brightness levels.
There are a lot of warm dimming and tuneable options. Phillips hue can run static 2000k-1800k if you want to go that route.
@Robin
brilliant reply. thank you. will look into elco and lotus. i bought and tested the Halo RL which is the price/quality/class of product i was hoping for… but i found it to be unnaturally orange/red in the lower end of the dimming range. i guess this might quantitatively be considered poor CRI at the low end? i haven’t measured/confirmed this, though - just felt unnatural to my eyes like i was in vegas neon or the red light district or something (disclaimer: i haven’t actually spent time in any red light district - just my best guess of what the ambience is like there)
@Oli
At 1800k with less you will have a stronger sensation of red. Even with lower r9 present. At that CCT to (strong red) generally reduces down to 50-60 CRI. Even with incandescent and sodium products. It’s just a very short set of wavelengths that are being used. You are reducing or eliminating all of the blue and green reproduction from the light. If your goal is more the yellow temperatures, then 2700-2200k is your sweet spot. 2000k starts to feel more orange, and leans into that amber light color.
The halo RL and elco sunset dims are pretty good, the elco will be slightly more consistent but has less futures (that’s the trade off, too many single options, less accuracy for the halo. Like a jack of all trades master of none)
I try to stay away from the very bottom of the market as it’s a poor investment and comes with more problems than solutions, but also the very top is often the similar poor investment but with more solutions than problems. The middle of the market is the sweet spot. At the economical entry level side you will be 15-30$ per module. At the mid you are 50-150(maybe 200), with the more expensive products having slightly better optics chipsets and drivers. Some are worth it, many are not. The high end 200-500$ range your just increasing options and possibly but not always the quality for the finishes (colors of trims galore) and above that you’re into the luxury brands and products that will basically offer endless customization top down. Although wonderful products they are often gate kept for silly reasons and are not justifiable for 99.99% of the market.
@Robin
thanks again. i might have a different (and potentially incorrect) understanding of CRI - this is certainly not my specialty. perhaps you can help steer me, but… my ideal room at night is lit exclusively by candles and squirrel cage incandescent edison bulbs dimmed low. are these not both near 100 CRI? and for sure, at such low temperature, there is a lot of red/orange and not much blue or green… but that’s okay with me and that’s the beauty of candlelight, hey?
i might try to take a photometer to each of the following to try to more quantitatively see / understand what it is that i’m trying to express?
- A. a candle
- B. an incandescent edison bulb
- C. an LED filament edison bulb
- D. the dimmed Halo RL (feels inaccurate but affordable)
- E. the dimmed Artafex 4 (feels accurate but expensive)
let me know if i’m off base! very possible i’m misunderstanding something
@Oli
Incandescent bulbs technically have 100% CRI as that’s just the nature of using a heat source that creates light as a byproduct. Incandescents are perfect black body radiators. However CRI is only a small part of understanding light and easily manipulated for led products. The key to understanding your problem (and for your experimentation with those different light sources) is to focus on R9 and spectral distribution.
R9 is a specific metric that measures how well reds (R) are rendered in your light source. You may have great CRI, but poor R9 in an LED. This is why your Halo RL may appear unnatural to you at the low end of the dimming spectrum. The key issue is how the light is delivered to you and at what point the light source’s spectrum drops off. The Halo RL may have a great CRI overall (because it’s hitting the most common wavelengths), but in the low end of the dimming range it likely sacrifices red wavelengths and pulls them out of the spectrum, leaving mostly blues and greens which gives you that unnaturally cold or odd red appearance.